Nicholas Davidoff

Thank you gentlemen for your great feedback. Looks like alot of this depends on the given situation and circumstances. I talked to our sound guy today who is an industry veteran, and he tells me he's had a handfull of experiences with gyros and close dialogue scenes where his microphones did pick up the whine. It was enough of an issue that it fell upon the director to make the call. What's more important to him, a stable shot or ideal sound? Every case will be different, i.e: Distance from the actors, sound level of the wind, sound level of the dialogue, sound level of the gyros, and how these all jive. I've definitely had a few situations where I could have used them. Seems like a great tool to have in the kit for those occasional times when they can really save the shot.

But now I have a question for Buzz. I thought industry standard steadicam gyros were KS-6's. I've also heard of some guys using KS-8's. But how well do those smaller KS-4's work for you vs. the KS-6's?

And another question: What type of sound barneys or material work good for gyros and does the heat become a factor?

Would love to hear from some fellow operators about their experiences using gyros. Specifically as it applies to lengthy dialogue scenes on windy exteriors. I know gyros are great on vehicle rigs and for action shooting on blustery days. But do many of you use them to stabilize during conventional dialogue scenes? Long lock offs? How problematic is it for sound? Does noise become an issue enough that the gyros can't be used? Do you keep them powered full time or unplug before you roll? Does this practice cut down the noise level?

I've been using antlers and 6x6 grip doubles to good success but occasionally these don't do the trick. Especially when you're caught doing long holds on dialogue scenes, taking wind hits. Any input is much appreciated.

~ Nick

If you're planning to be a professional steadicam operator, you need a rig that handle at least a 20 pound camera. Anything less than that, in my opinion is a child's toy. I don't know your particular market, but in the U.S., you can't show up on a set and tell the DP your rig only takes a "stripped down" Epic. Even an Epic will require a lens, matte box, filters, preston motors and MDR, usually a cinetape, time code box, maybe some other stuff and all the brackets and cables to go with it. Save up the proper capital for this business investment. Otherwise you're stuck with a rig that's only good for practicing and maybe an occasional freebie or amateur video.

I make cables for the preston to run the Epic if anyone needs one.

Given the aforementioned circumstances Chris, I find this a little hard to believe. Can you show some sort of working proof or photos of this alleged Epic run/stop cable of yours. If it works, I'll buy one. But given that the geniuses at Preston and C-motion can't devise a solution, please understand my skepticism.

And an open message to the guys at Red: This is ridiculous! WTF!

Thanks for the info Mark. Looks like the 4 pin sync input on the Epic requires a 3.3 volt signal to start/stop the camera. Is this something the Preston MDR puts out? Maybe this is what Preston is talking about when they require a chip or voltage converter? I also saw the three headed BNC to Sync cable Red is selling. Since you're only using one of the BNC leads for start/stop, theoretically you can cut off the other two. So now you have two cables: An MDR to BNC cable which mates with a BNC to Epic sync port cable. So eliminate the BNC junction and make it all one cable, right? Am I missing something here? Personally, I'd love to simply buy a working cable and stay out of the technical stuff. I talked to Terry West today and he's looking into it. Terry, or somebody, please give a shout when you have a completed and fully tested Epic run cable. There will be many orders for this one I'm sure.

Does anyone have any solid leads on an Epic run cable for a Preston. It's a smaller Lemo connector than the Red One, I believe it's a size "0" or "1" labeled "sync" port. I hear this connector alone cannot be obtained from Lemo and was custom built for Red. I also hear from Preston that they need to build a special cable with a built in chip to interface with a special Red 3 headed Sync cable which interfaces with the Epic body. And Preston is currently backordered on it's half of this cable collaboration. Anybody have any more info on how we're supposed to run/stop an Epic through our Preston? Any word from Red?

You guys have all summed it up for me. I don't know of anyone who operates a fluid head with their left hand dangling by their side. The majority of the time your left hand ends up gripping somewhere around the front of the head. Wether it's under the lens rods or the front part of the head itself. Just natural leverage I guess. So having a handle there makes perfect sense. I've used this handle before and loved it. Rental houses rarely have one. I also have a rod mounted left hand grip that I use occasionally and even attach a microforce to it sometimes. To each his own. Works for me. I figured I'd check for a used handle before I order one new.

Just ordered mine from B&H here - http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?Ntt=oconnor+front+handle&N=0&InitialSearch=yes

Thanks for the feedback!

Anybody have one of these laying around that they want to sell? It's a front mounted operating handle for Oconnor 2575 or 120EX fluid head.

"Beware of the 3Ality TS-5. Neither GPI nor Bael-bel hole spacing was compatible. I had to have the channels on my plates custom machined to fit this rig (and off center)."

 

 

Nick,

 

Can't say I had the same experience. They had a plate that was Pro compatible on the bottom of their rig when I tried it. I even went as far as warning that not all "stabilization" rigs used the same design, but most did. Worked great for me and a Pro DB3 though.

Alec, correct me if I'm wrong, but you probably had the rig off "Spiderman". This was likely the TS-5 LITE carbon fiber, not a regular TS-5. Difference = several pounds. Regardless, they had a custom built Pro plate with rods extending out the back with a mount for an AB batt and accessories. Was this plate silver and un-anodized? I'm currently using the same one. Yes, this custom plate is GPI compatible. As for the hole spacing on the bottom of the TS-5's, I'm not sure what that's supposed to be compatible with. I'll post some pics if I get a chance.

And yes Osvaldo, this was your old plate. Has worked great a few times when other plates didn't line up. Thinking of getting a back up.

I might be starting a heated debate here, but looks like the Baer-Bel plate would give you the most mounting options. Especially for unconventional hole patterns. I find this plate to be plenty rigid. Wouldn't work for Panavision though. Looks like the XCS is a great and rigid plate, but it's obviously higher and raises your CG. Aaarrrrr! Why can't somebody make 1 perfect plate for every camera?!?

Yes Tom, that's the one. Thanks for the help guys. I'll look into them both.

FYI - As far as camera plates go, just recently had two situations where my GPI plates didn't fit. Flew a Vistavision and only my Baer-bel plate lined up. Then there's some real funky hole spacing on the bottom of these new 3d rigs. Also had to offset the plate to balance the rig side-side. Beware of the 3Ality TS-5. Neither GPI nor Bael-bel hole spacing was compatible. I had to have the channels on my plates custom machined to fit this rig (and off center). An industry standard RBQR plate doesn't even fit and needs to be custom cut. A fine rig, but somebody at 3Ality really dropped the ball when they decided their hole spacing.

Does anybody know who makes this mounting plate and where can I get one? It's GPI compatible.

Does it fold up nicely for shipping?

What it does do is prove that you were infact there with your gear, so in a court you actually have at least 1 leg to stand on if the prod company tries to get out of it.

 

 

Actually it's the PR that shows that you were there along with the payroll timecard. Having the cert proves that production represented that you were insured for any loss while in their employ.

So should this be standard practice for us to call the Insurance company to verify that we are in fact ON the policy?

I know this has been discussed here on the forum quite a bit and it never gets old. Even though we have a "cert", that cert might have no legal value in the event of an actual claim. Like you guys say, just a piece of paper with your name typed in a box. I believe this is where a solid and detailed rental agreement should come into the picture. Although I haven't been in this legal situation yet (knock wood), from everything I've learned this signed rental agreement would give you a legal leg to stand on. Same doc as all the rental houses have you sign. There are lengthy threads on this forum about this, so I won't get deep into it.

Alec,

The TS-5 you tested, was it the original TS-5, or the newer carbon fiber lightweight TS-5?

I believe Dave L. had the lightweight Carbon fiber on Spidey.

EVERY job I've ever worked, big or small, has always supplied an insurance cert. The only exception may have been once or twice if I was helping a buddy shoot some student video in his backyard over the weekend or something. Insurance cert, ALWAYS, across the board. This is industry standard on projects as small as student level. If they are renting ANY gear from any rental house, they have been required to provide equipment coverage. So they have a policy in place. It's just a simple matter of printing out a certificate for you with yourself listed as certificate holder. This production company is clearly not very experienced, so like Rob advised, politely explain to them that this is how things are done and it is the industry standard. I believe 99.9% of professional operators in the U.S. will agree.

The reason I wanted to chime in on this thread, is to reinforce this point and make sure no one out there is foolishly "waiving" their insurance requirements. If people start doing this, it will spread like wildfire and producers will quickly adopt a new standard for operators to provide their own insurance because "the last guy did". Of course many of us carry our own insurance coverage. But this has nothing to do with the coverage production must provide. And it is, in my opinion, none of their business wether or not I have insurance on my gear. It does not even enter the conversation. Please educate your beginner producers and your fellow operators. It's a hard enough battle we all fight for rates, professional treatment and of course proper insurance coverage for our gear. So please stick with the program folks.

Xlnt info. Thanks Alec. I'll report back after my experience with this rig.

Has anybody flown this rig on steadi yet? 3Ality website says the rig weighs in at 30 pounds. I'm assuming that's without cameras. Anybody have any experience with this system they could share? How does it compare to the P+S Technik Freestyle or the Element Technica Atom?

Let's say you're using a P+S Freestyle rig with 2 Epics. The total sled weight comes out to around 85 pounds. About 5 pounds beyond the highest capacity Arm. I understand there are heavier 3D rigs out there. How do people manage these beyond the weight capacity of the Pro or the G70 arms??? Not that I would ever want to try this, but just wondering.

Also, back to the inevitable discussion about rates. I and other steadicam colleaugues of mine are charging much higher rates for flying 3D and rightfully so. I believe the same should apply for handheld 3D operating. If any precedents are to be set, this should be one of the most important.

My "Chopper" with an Alexa and OB-1 Flashmag Deck by S.two.

OB1 Deck weighs in at 7lbs, similar to the Codex, maybe slightly heavier. Deck is custom mounted on my bottom base, therefore offsetting a big chunk of weight from the top of the rig. Allows me to keep my post shorter, gimbal higher and better balance throughout. I'm flying only two batteries, one on top and one below, to keep the overall weight down and achieve ideal weight distro top to bottom. i've had very decent run times with this 2 battery setup. Sled is also in full dynamic balance.

A skinny triax cable runs from the top stage to the bottom, carrying dual video lines and a power line from the camera to the deck. This also triggers the recording sync. This cable running down the sled is barely a nuisance and doesn't affect the handling of the rig.

Only one Dionic HC on bottom base otherwise the rig gets too bottom heavy with too much space above the gimbal. Battery at the base powers my monitor and all camera accessories up top via 12V p-tap power from topstage. Cinetape, Preston, Downconverter, Camwave and onboard monitor if necessary.

Battery on board Camera is a 12V lithium ion, 95W/hr. Powers only the camera body and deck. No accessories. Great run times with heavy use and a good hour or two between swaps. Hot swap can be done if necessary with a standy block battery and power cable. Otherwise, restart time is exactly 15 sec.

The point here is, if you can figure a way to mount the deck to the bottom base (similar to what Neal did), you can probably get away with a total of two batteries for power and have a nicely balanced, lighter and smaller sled.

This thread seems to be evolving into a liability insurance discussion. Since we're on the subject, how much is an average yearly (or monthly) liability policy for an operator in the U.S?

This question has been asked and answered here thousands of times. Read up a bit and you'll find what you are looking for.

Agreed. All of your questions have been asked and answered dozens of times over. Spend several hours and read all the threads on operating, newbies and rigs. My advice as always, unless you have a specific niche market lined up, don't get into steadicam. If you've done thorough market research, you'll notice there are many more "operators" now than there are job demands. Hence all the great rigs for sale on the forum.

As far as your startup costs, $25,000 is a very meager budget. As you know, you will be limited to flying only lightweight video cameras. I don't know your geographical area, so perhaps light video is a thriving marketplace where you are, but I don't see anybody making a living flying DSLR's and handicams.

Just some friendly advice that I learned on my own. Work is very hard to come by and if you think that other operators in your area will be supportive and excited that you're entering the playing field, then think again.

If, after knowing this you still wanna do it, then more power to you.

.

Same here. I had a great experience with the service department at IDX. Had an issue with my Camwave which was promptly taken care of by Zach and a very courteous and helpful IDX staff.

Still looking for a DB-1, any condition. Anybody have one laying around the garage?

I got an email today from Matthias that the Alexa plates are ready to ship from Germany. If any of you guys who have ordered one are interested in saving a few dollars on international Fedex, maybe we can send a few (or several) in one package and split the shipping. Acording to Fedex rate-finder, a 2 pound package from Germany to L.A. costs around $100. A 10 pound package costs around $140. Maybe ship five plates in one pop at around $30 a piece???

If anybody in the Burbank/Valley area is interested, please drop me a line in the next couple days and I'll see if we can set this up.

~ Nick Davidoff

(310) 567-9668

NicholasDavidoff@hotmail.com