New Company to watch out for

[Eric Fletcher S.O.C.]

As the operator if you arent paid then you own the copyright to the image.

 

-Jess

I'm not an attorney, but I'm not sure that's always the case. I believe it depends on the laws in the state you're in as well as whether you did steadicam or just conventional operating.

Are you positive that this is the case in CA Jess?

 

 

Transfer of copyright happens when the check is cashed, that's federal law.....

[Brad Grimmett]

Transfer of copyright happens when the check is cashed, that's federal law.....

I've heard that a lot before, but I've also heard it's only if you're doing steadicam, and I've also heard it's not federal law. I've heard all of these things from people without law degrees, like me, so it's hard to consider any of it solid fact.

Didn't you deal with this at some point Eric? Maybe you're the person to ask...

[Eric Fletcher S.O.C.]

Transfer of copyright happens when the check is cashed, that's federal law.....

I've heard that a lot before, but I've also heard it's only if you're doing steadicam, and I've also heard it's not federal law. I've heard all of these things from people without law degrees, like me, so it's hard to consider any of it solid fact.

Didn't you deal with this at some point Eric? Maybe you're the person to ask...

 

 

Well it only applies if "you materially contribute to the creation of art" which is what we do when we are steadicam operators because we are making creative decisions, It gets grey when it's just conventional operating. (Same criteria for being an employee or an independent contractor) Copyright law is federal, not state or local especially since it's distribution is not confined to the immediate area of production. All of this information has been confirmed by an entertainment law attorney and upheld almost 20 years ago with a favorable settlement for a unpaid second unit DP.

 

I dealt with this 13 years ago when a film i worked on had the production company attempt to declare bank and then buy back the film from a friendly bankruptcy court in an attempt to not pay the cast and crew. Because I knew the law and can be a bit vindictive when it comes to screwing me over on money I was present at the bankruptcy hearing when the producer tried to pull off his scam.... Needless to say I was paid my full amount + punitive damages

[Jess Haas SOC]

My understanding of the way the law is interperted (that would be federal copyright law) is that the camera operator and the sound recordist own the copyright to the physical recordings as they are the ones recording them(if recording off camera this may be a less clear cut case). Your deal memo will say that it is a work for hire and as such they own the copyright but if you are not paid then that contract is not in effect.

 

I am of course not a lawyer and have never played one on TV.

 

-Jess

[Rob Vuona SOC]

Ok , all y'all arm chair federal copyright attorneys here's the dilemma myself and the rest of the crew is in. We were hired by one production company to do a week long concert festival, 5 bands a day in South Dekota. That particular production company originally had the rights to all the footage and everything having to do with the venue including the take of entrance fees. They ended up selling all the rights and responsibility to another company a week prior to the event, not telling any of us on the crew. That company decided they didn't want to pay any of us. We all have a class action suit against them and they are in process of agreeing to settle for 60.5 percent if the total. Oh and by the way , the company being sued is in NJ, we worked in South Dekota and the Crew is from CA and NY and there were 12 cameras.

 

Can we all take ownership of the footage until we get paid?

[Mark Schlicher]

Since the new company's right to air or distribute the show are clouded by the lawsuit, I'm guessing that ownership/authorship (copyright) is your attorneys' biggest lever in the negotiations.

 

If you had a contract with company A as work-for-hire, and they didn't pay...and then the rights and obligations were transferred to company B, then company B doesn't have clear rights to the work until the work-for-hire contract is executed (ie., you get paid.)

 

Shame that you had to sue, and may have to settle for less than what is owed. Better than nothing I suppose.

[RonBaldwin]

Ok , all y'all arm chair federal copyright attorneys here's the dilemma myself and the rest of the crew is in. We were hired by one production company to do a week long concert festival, 5 bands a day in South Dekota. That particular production company originally had the rights to all the footage and everything having to do with the venue including the take of entrance fees. They ended up selling all the rights and responsibility to another company a week prior to the event, not telling any of us on the crew. That company decided they didn't want to pay any of us. We all have a class action suit against them and they are in process of agreeing to settle for 60.5 percent if the total. Oh and by the way , the company being sued is in NJ, we worked in South Dekota and the Crew is from CA and NY and there were 12 cameras.

 

Can we all take ownership of the footage until we get paid?

 

I'd get the boys from NY to go thump their skulls...don't bring the Ca guys (except Brad), we all just talk a big talk but are a bunch of pussies (excepting the afore mentioned large operator with iron fists and unequalled poker ability).

[William Demeritt]

Ok , all y'all arm chair federal copyright attorneys here's the dilemma myself and the rest of the crew is in. We were hired by one production company to do a week long concert festival, 5 bands a day in South Dekota. That particular production company originally had the rights to all the footage and everything having to do with the venue including the take of entrance fees. They ended up selling all the rights and responsibility to another company a week prior to the event, not telling any of us on the crew. That company decided they didn't want to pay any of us. We all have a class action suit against them and they are in process of agreeing to settle for 60.5 percent if the total. Oh and by the way , the company being sued is in NJ, we worked in South Dekota and the Crew is from CA and NY and there were 12 cameras.

 

Can we all take ownership of the footage until we get paid?

 

I think ownership of the footage is secondary to getting your rate, unless you think the footage is a valuable asset with interested buyers already lined up. Ultimately, you want your contracted rate/money owed, regardless of the status of the footage.

 

What was the grounds for which they didn't want to pay? Didn't agree to the rates, so they refused all payment? Simply don't have the cash to cover the payment? Also, was your contract with the original company, or did they have you sign a new contract with the new company? Likewise, what has happened to the footage of the festival? Packaged and sold? Still being held onto?

 

I would imagine if the original company sold off all the rights, but let you continue to do the work knowing the new company had no interest in the footage and just wanted the box office, then the original company is still liable for your rates if they knowingly allowed you to work the job whose footage was doomed without canceling you.

 

If the new company accepted your contracts, but later decided the footage was to be doomed, then they're liable for your rates as per the contract regardless of if a useable product results (just as if you were hired for a 1-day commercial, worked successfully but the finished commercial was never sold or aired).

[Rob Vuona SOC]

Will,

The ground of them not wanting to pay is as far as I can tell, not the rates just a conflict in contract between companies. The company being sued is HD Logix apparently they are a multi million dollar company and most definitely have the money to pay. There were no signed deal contracts until payroll and start-up paperwork was filled out on site. That's when we found out we were now working for s different company. The footage is in the hands of HD Logix and is retaining the rights to it. The bought the rights to everything having to do with the festival. I don't know if any of the footage has been used for anything yet, I dont think so considering we are sueing them. They basically are saying they are guilty of not paying by asking us all to settle for 60.5% but made it clear they won't make it easy for us to collect all the money.

 

We were advised by our Class Action Attorney to take the settlement deal because if we decided to fight for the rest of the money and punitive damages and attorney fees, South Dekota labor law only allows double the amount to be charged if found guilty and the attorneys will take 40% along with the time for depositions and flights, so it would most likely be drawn out for 2 years.

[Mark Schlicher]

Yup, sounds like they're just a**holes.

 

They may have "bought all the rights" but your lawsuit puts a big wrinkle in their sweet little deal, because the lack of payment puts a cloud over the ownership of the footage.

 

As long as the contract with crew hasn't been honored (or negotiated in a settlement), the copyright to the show is in dispute, and distributors and broadcasters won't touch it.

 

As a practical matter your lawyers are probably wise to advise you to settle, but it still sucks that the company appears to be blatantly feeding off of the backs of hardworking crew "because they can." It could very well have been part of their business plan on the front end of the deal.