Another Helicopter Crash with Film Crew

[Dan Coplan]

But there must be shots that are as safe as transporting people and cargo. I've done a number of Miami Vice-style fly overs (the opening where it's just a straight line over the water) and general tourist type shots that don't involve acrobatics and crazy turns. But again, I don't know what to look for as far as safety is concerned even with simple flying.

[Daniel Stilling DFF]

If you are shooting action happening on the ground or in the air, there's a lot of timing and other issues that quickly errode the safety margins.

If you are shooting an estabilishing shot of a city, just by overflying it, for ex, the safety margin is much higher, as it only involves the one aircraft. But still, does the director want the aircraft to fly low and slow in a single engine plane?

On a feature I did in Costa Rica a few years ago, production wanted to save money and rented a Cessna 172 instead of a choper, to shoot estabilishing shots of the house we were shooting in. The house had a clff behind and the beach in front.

I refused to do it, and the gaffer went instead. I saw that plane doing slow flight, probably a few knots over stall speed, 50 feet above the house, and doing steep turns to avoid the cliffs. I was just waiting to see the crash. Luckily nothing happened, but the gaffer was one scared man when he got back to set.

Flying low and slow doing steep turns like this is pretty much the most dangerous thing you can do in an airplane.

So, if you have to do it, use common sense, cliffs and aircraft don't mix very well. But I still vote for NO.

There's a saying in aviation: "There are old pilots and bold pilots, but there aren't old, bold pilots"

[Eric Fletcher S.O.C.]

I refused to do it, and the gaffer went instead. I saw that plane doing slow flight, probably a few knots over stall speed, 50 feet above the house, and doing steep turns to avoid the cliffs. I was just waiting to see the crash. Luckily nothing happened, but the gaffer was one scared man when he got back to set.

Flying low and slow doing steep turns like this is pretty much the most dangerous thing you can do in an airplane.

 

 

Daniel,

 

I do slow flight all the time there IS NOTHING WRONG with doing it. Maybe you have issues with slow flight but it's a state of flight that is easy to fly in.

 

And in case you are wondering I have been a pilot pretty much all my adult life.

[paul magee]

Here's a good primer on aerials - http://www.aerialcinematography.com

 

I believe this type of work is best left to the pros.

 

 

 

Paul Magee

Philadelphia, PA

[David Allen Grove]

My dad saw this on the Local CBS news station's website in Iowa. (where I'm originally from).

Thought you all would like to read it.

Here is the link: http://www.kcci.com/news/9459435/detail.html

=========================================================

Eric,

 

I think now is not the time to start arguments about how safe filming from helicopters is.

 

A fellow operator just lost his life on Friday for crying out loud.

[Daniel Stilling DFF]

Daniel,

 

Maybe you have issues with slow flight but it's a state of flight that is easy to fly in.

 

And in case you are wondering I have been a pilot pretty much all my adult life.

 

C'mon Eric, are you kidding me??

 

Nobody says that there's anything wrong with slow flight, neither do I have a problem with it when I'm not close to the ground, and I don't have to defend my abilities here, but if you tell me that the slow flight you do is in the same conditions as I described, 50 feet above ground, then I'm happy to never share a cockpit with you.

Man, I'm happy you're proud of your acomplishments as a pilot, but I would preffer if we leave bashing to the side and we stick to the topic, shall we??

[Eric Fletcher S.O.C.]

I think now is not the time to start arguments about how safe filming from helicopters is.

 

A fellow operator just lost his life on Friday for crying out loud.

 

 

First off David I knew Roland quite well, secondly I don't think that you need to be posting every article and link on it until there is a determination of facts from the NTSB on the accident.

 

It well understood that you won't fly in them, that's fine, but honestly you are not a pilot nor someone that understands helicopters all that well and I get tired of seeing you go on and on about it.

[Eric Fletcher S.O.C.]

Nobody says that there's anything wrong with slow flight, neither do I have a problem with it when I'm not close to the ground, and I don't have to defend my abilities here, but if you tell me that the slow flight you do is in the same conditions as I described, 50 feet above ground, then I'm happy to never share a cockpit with you.

 

 

It's interesting that you made an observation that an aircraft was in slow flight only a few knots above stall speed, all the while you were on the ground.

 

Slow flight is a normal regime of bush pilots and powerline inspectors and a multitude of other flying jobs, there is NOTHING overtly dangerous with it as long as you are practiced in it . As long as the pilot was VSo*1.3 he was well within safety margins.

 

iirc you are a low time pilot, maybe you would be well served to take a an upset course or a mountain flying course to learn just what you can do in an aircraft, you might be surprised.

[Daniel Stilling DFF]

Eric,

 

Why you like to do this is beyond me. I'm sure you're happy that you had the opportunity to tell everybody here how experienced and proficient of a pilot you are. Me? I just have an opinion that I voiced. You as a moderator bear the responsability to be impartial and fair, open to opinions.

Unfortunatelly, you have shown that you're far from that. It's a shame that you're using this sad happening to show off.

That's it, let's quit this...

[David Allen Grove]

First off David I knew Roland quite well, secondly I don't think that you need to be posting every article and link on it until there is a determination of facts from the NTSB on the accident.

 

It well understood that you won't fly in them, that's fine, but honestly you are not a pilot nor someone that understands helicopters all that well and I get tired of seeing you go on and on about it.

 

Good gravey. I was going to respond point by point but it's just going to make this post too darn long and

heaven forbid I get put on "approval."

 

I'll keep it short.

 

First paragraph: Defensive, Bragging, censoring, Demeaning, :o

 

 

Second Paragraph: Demeaning, Demeaning, stop reading my posts over and over again it will give you the illusion I posted more than TWICE in this thread. 2 articles is going on and on? :blink:

 

 

In short.. you like to argue and you cause problems... the forum has sunk to a new low.. Moderators creating conflict on the board...

 

 

I should do the same for his responses to Daniel's posts.. demeaning. demeaning. bragging.... ug.. I have better things to do like plan the long awaited Steadicam Guild Gathering. OH YEA!

 

 

EDIT ADDITION: I just saw Daniels post above.. (must have typed at same time).

 

Daniel is correct... 100%

[Alec Jarnagin SOC]

Wow, this is beyond stupid. I'm spending the weekend with family and I thought I'd check in for a moment, but now I'm sorry I did.

 

I'm closing this thread. I realize some have the option to reopen, but I'd appreciate it if we just moved on.

 

Come on people?