Interesting new rig

[William Demeritt]

Best troll ever. Move along people.

[Shawn Sutherland]

Best troll ever. Move along people.

 

I thank you from the heart of my bottom.

 

No, really!

[Barry Mkokiner]

Best troll ever. Move along people.

 

"Application of the term troll is subjective. Some readers may characterize a post as trolling, while others may regard the same post as a legitimate contribution to the discussion, even if controversial"

 

I got that from Google.

 

Troll or not, an interesting point was raised that no one has addressed: Put a Movi in top of a Steadicam sled and take some footage. Is anybody going to do it?

[Charles Papert]

To paraphrase Dennis Farina's line in "Midnight Run": Barry, relax. Have a cream soda.

 

You are aware that the Movi is not yet in production?! This test will get out there soon enough. I know the Movi guys have already been playing with this sort of thing for a while.

 

It really doesn't take much imagination to figure out what the combination of gimbal stabilizer on top a Steadicam will look like; it would likely be quite stable. We've already seen active roll axis correction via the AR rig. The only thing I'd be curious about is whether it will introduce twitchiness or chatter into long lens work that wouldn't be there on the bare Steadicam rig.

 

What won't show up in a typical test video is lag in reaction time with a two-man system. And while it should work to put the gimbal into one-man aka Majestic mode, the corresponding lag that involves in pan/tilt is going to be a major annoyance for one used to panning and tilting a Steadicam with immediate results. So there's a compromise involved in operating with the current modality.

 

I won't address this directly to the trollish chap but perhaps to others who may be quietly applauding him on the sidelines (it's become something of a bloodsport for wannabes to cheer what they view as the breaking down of the walls between them and seasoned professionals--thank you RED): what may not be obvious is that a lot of people on this board have many, many hours logged of operating not just Steadicams but various kinds of remote cameras from Jimmy Jibs to Technocranes to Sparrow heads to Skycam etc. That means that they know intimately well what degree of communication is required when more than one person is responsible for moving a camera through space and operating it vs a one-man band. Every good Steadicam operator understands how to react to elements around them and make adjustments simultaneously in any and all axes (angular and spatial). Once you start splitting out those tasks, there will inevitably be a delay as corrections are made sequentially rather than simultaneously. It's the framing equivalent of finding focus on a DSLR by rotating the barrel back and forth until it looks sharp instead of hitting the mark the first time.

[Ken Nguyen]

 

Best troll ever. Move along people.

 

"Application of the term troll is subjective. Some readers may characterize a post as trolling, while others may regard the same post as a legitimate contribution to the discussion, even if controversial"

 

I got that from Google.

 

Troll or not, an interesting point was raised that no one has addressed: Put a Movi in top of a Steadicam sled and take some footage. Is anybody going to do it?

 

Why one should mount the Movi on top of Steadicam sled or arm?

 

Because we, Steadicam ops, can not keep the vertical and horizontal roll of the camera?

Because we, Steadicam ops, can not make a stable/smooth shot?

Because we, Steadicam ops, can not frame the shot as a cameraman?

 

The combination of Steadicam and Movi is dumb set up.

It gives no practical and effective result.

Putting the Movi on Steadicam sled to helps correcting horizontal/vertical roll? or, to have DP framing the shot for you?

A real Steadicam operator is a real cameraman who operates Steadicam system.

 

 

Ken Nguyen.

 

PS: someone wants to drive a car but wants the wheel to be controlled by someone else.

All he has to do is pressing the gas pedal and the brake (but his braking skill is also in doubt or suck, so the guy who controls the wheel also controls the brake... And... the gas pedal as well).

[Brian Freesh]

Everyone has figured out Barry's name... right?

[RonBaldwin]

Everyone has figured out Barry's name... right?

Words to live by.

[Wolfgang Troescher]

Combining MoVi with Steadicam is really weird. As a result, you're adding the disadvantages of both systems but loosing the advantages.

 

Disadvantage of Steadicam: You need an experienced operator

Advantage of MoVi: You are more flexible

[Sam Morgan Moore]

If readers want to see a 'stabilised head' on a steadicam here is my 2axis gopro head mounted on a 2m pole on my Pilot arm via a home made gimbal.

 

notes

this is a non shot :)

the footage has some flicker which is a post issue

there is one significant bump which is me bumping the rig on a Cstand - operator error, not a computer malfunction.

 

https://vimeo.com/69972792 PWD gyro

 

Its it useful?

- I get an incredible boom range

- it is not as useful as a Tango but is significantly cheaper

-my horizon is good even though I am a newb op

 

Whats bad?

 

No monitor

Shitty camera

 

Overall I think that..

1) Operators who know steadicam will be the best Movi ops

2) Engineers who know steadicam will make the best Movi style devices

3) The Movi is a different but related tool

4) many shots are simplest/best done with a Steadicam even with a newb operator

Edited September 1, 2013 by Sam Morgan Moore

[AndreasKielb]

I'll try my portahead system overslung on the steadicam sled soon. Also I was about to order a gore-link until I saw the picture of how low the camera will hang underslung from the wire.

 

 

That's why I see a benefit in putting the rig on the sled itself in overslung mode. You will need a monitor and batteries for the rig anyway and the steadicam sled can provide both of course. The extra weight of the sled itself is not that much if you use the brushless system with an Epic size camera. Just a light weight for a steadicam.

 

What you gain is to get rid of the foodsteps and have the camera at eye level or at the usual steadicam heights at least (also in low mode and underslung). I'm not sure how and if the overslung mode will be possible with the movi as I don't know about the software and sensor orientation but it is possible with the alexmos boards.

 

I'ld say if it makes sense or not to put the rig on the steadicam sled depends on the shot. Imagine a steadicam shot that starts quite close on an actor and then pulls out slowly to a very wide shot of the whole plaza to visualize the sudden loneliness of the character, maybe even down some stairs, music, end titles etc. As the actor isn't moving at all every little pan and horizon error will clearly sidetrack from the narrative intention of the scene. Very difficult for many operators at least.

 

Also imagine a shot running at full speed through the woods in Don Juan. With a brushless gimbal on the rig you can fully concentrate on your path as the remote operator will take care of the framing.

 

I'll also provide analog joysticks with the portahead for single operator mode. There are 3 differnet preset profiles possible with the alexmos software and I thought to use them in this way:

 

Preset 1: two operator mode with wireless RC control
Preset 2: single operator mode with analog joysticks at the handles
Preset 3: wireless RC control mode but with reversed motor directions for overslung mode with the pan motor below the camera

 

I'll also provide instruction videos on how to change the settings in the software directly so that more options are possible than those presets.

[Shawn Sutherland]

See? Told ya' so.

[Eric Fletcher S.O.C.]

See? Told ya' so.

 

Told us what? you still don't understand how this would be used on a show, and you still don't understand what we do.

 

SO no you didn't "Tell" us anything

[Shawn Sutherland]

 

See? Told ya' so.

 

Told us what? you still don't understand how this would be used on a show, and you still don't understand what we do.

 

SO no you didn't "Tell" us anything

 

 

You obviously have nothing better to do than "go to the bathroom out of your face" at people you don't agree with. Jesus get a life!

 

I never claimed to understand how this would be used on a show, and I couldn't care less. It was never about that, it still isn't, and you're not changing the subject on my watch.

 

I predicted somebody would put a Movi on a Steadicam sled and now we're about to see that happen. That's it, that's all.

 

I told you would it happen and I was right.

 

It's just a matter of time now.

[RonBaldwin]

If I recall correctly the issue of your innexperience and us old farts whining and mumbling arised when you claimed it would be better if the dp controlled the camera operation, not the physicality of mounting one of these on an arm or sled (which, like the Alien - around in the mid-90's - solved some issues but created a whole bunch of others). Not to mention it was really never perfected.

 

Someone should talk to Colin Hudson who did the new Robocop movie. They put something like this on his sled for Robocop's pov and I don't think it worked as well as Colin just doing it himself. The response is always faster and things can be anticipated when right there on the camera and not 15' behind or tucked away in a tent.

 

Watching all the swatting at this gnat is getting tiresome. Maybe I'll go back to set and get back to work while the gnat stays here and tries to stir theoretical bs up and rearrange the set duties.

[Eric Fletcher S.O.C.]

 

 

See? Told ya' so.

 

Told us what? you still don't understand how this would be used on a show, and you still don't understand what we do.

 

SO no you didn't "Tell" us anything

 

 

You obviously have nothing better to do than "go to the bathroom out of your face" at people you don't agree with. Jesus get a life!

 

I never claimed to understand how this would be used on a show, and I couldn't care less. It was never about that, it still isn't, and you're not changing the subject on my watch.

 

I predicted somebody would put a Movi on a Steadicam sled and now we're about to see that happen. That's it, that's all.

 

I told you would it happen and I was right.

 

It's just a matter of time now.

 

 

No you have claimed to know how we work. Claimed to know that all DP's want to operate the shot. You have no watch here don't give yourself that much credit.

 

The Movi HAS been put up on a steadicam back in January and February LONG before you knew it even existed so no you get no credit, you didn't tell us anything.

 

While you think that putting a movi on a sled will make you an equal to a proper operator you are sorely mistaken

 

I'm sure that you will respond with something asinine again....