Premium Members Alan Rencher Posted July 2, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Greg, I was just going on what Chris @ cinetronic said in a previous thread: http://www.steadicamforum.com/index.php?/topic/16349-Dp7pro-high-bright&do=findComment&comment=89556 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Jens Piotrowski SOC Posted July 3, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 That refers to the next available screen ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Alan Rencher Posted July 3, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 That refers to the next available screen ... It's a good thing he has you to speak for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Eric Fletcher S.O.C. Posted July 3, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 That refers to the next available screen ... It's a good thing he has you to speak for him. Jens is correct, Chris let quite a few of us know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike skipp Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Greg, Thank you for your testing and insight into the heating problem with our monitor. Although this heating problem has never become an issue with any of out monitor owners in normal daily use, it still did raise some concern. We have since done our own testing, and found the problem as well. We have made the necessary changes, and have implemented some new heatsinking which eliminates this problem. We have tested the retrofitted monitors for 2 hours in direct sunlight at 96 degrees ambient temperature, and have not seen a heat problem. All new monitors shipped will have the updated design, and we will update existing monitors we have sold. Also in our testing we found the existing design to work quite well, even when severely heated, it would cool down with a couple minutes in the shade. With a light overcast, the heat problem is not an issue. Needless to say it has been resolved, and thanks for pointing this out to us. We look forward to your testing and evaluation of other companies monitors as well, so Steadicam operators who don't own a Cinetronic can have the same peace of mind as Cinetronic owners. Our design philosophy from the start was to build a sealed design, without fans or vents, and to use passive cooling. This was the basis for the Gen1, and we continue this with the Gen2. After attending the monitor shootout some years ago, we saw the disadvantages to vents fans etc. Most monitor manufactures overlook the fact that their products will often be used in dusty, dirty environments, and fans and vents just allow the monitor to fill up with dirt. This dust and dirt can cause many problems, first off, unless you have an optically bonded screen, it can migrate between the screen and the acrylic cover over the screen, so you are forever looking at a dirty monitor. The dust also coats the electronics, and causes their temperatures to rise, and makes the monitor run progressively hotter as time goes on. Anyone who has shot on a set where they were using fullers earth, can understand how it finds its way into absolutely everything. Fans are also prone to fail and to make noise, and the last thing you want is the sound man after you when you are shooting a few feet from an actor, and the sound of your monitor is being heard. The added heatsinking actually allows the Gen2 to perform better than the Gen1 in high heat, with direct sunlight, despite being smaller and lighter than the Gen1. The Gen2 uses the same time tested screen as the Gen1, which still offers the best color of any 7" screen available. The added heatsinking does increase the weight of the Gen2 slightly though. This added weight, combined with the weight back, or anton bauer back + battery brings the weight to almost exactly that of the TB6. This will make it even easier for TB6 owners to upgrade to a color monitor, without having to make changes to the balance of their rigs. Mike Skipp & Chris Bangma Cinetronic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members William Demeritt Posted July 3, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Mike, Can you share some photos of what the new heat dissipation methods look like? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members chris bangma Posted July 3, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 This is an internal modification to the screen bezel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Jens Piotrowski SOC Posted July 3, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Don't share this information http://www.thegreencarwebsite.co.uk/cms-images/2012_11_Cooling-towers-flickr.com-montgomery-county-planning-commision.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members GregBubb Posted July 3, 2013 Author Premium Members Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Mike and Chris Well, I am glad that someone finally posted online they too have seen this issue. I know that others have emailed stating that they have see the issue, but elected not to post for their own reasons. I certainly was not picking on any one monitor. It happen that two operators had their sleds in house for updates and upon testing my work, I always burn in repairs for failures, the issues was noticed. The owners were notified for disclosure on what I had seen in case of damage. I wanted to see if anyone else had the issue. That answer was defiantly “YES” and with shorter failure times then I had seen. I don’t plan on being a aftermarket tester of manufacturers LCD’s, but being and operator for 29 years does give me and along with a few other operators the background on what can be expected from a product put into our environment, and its performance expectations. LCD will always have a lower temperature failure rate (cold to hot range) by technical limitations of the LCD design Vs other technologies. Fans, vent, or other cooling devices that one can use when properly implemented into a product design, go unnoticed or cause no issues that I have seen. And I have seen it on both sides of the market as producer of products and being a critical end user. I never liked eating a cost of shipping because an error in a product design or assembly error. I have seen a few myself over the past 17 years. As far as the 1024 x600 Vs the 1280 x 800 screen color comparison, if we are talking about the screen capabilities I will have to politely disagree with you on the screens ability to reproduce color via the technical specification sheets by the manufacturer of the screens. If we including the circuit boards firmware/software’s ability to reproduce the input color, that can vary from monitor to monitor and does. But there are standards that I have noticed that most follow because most LCD manufacturers put their name on a product built by other companies which is a standard practice in the industry. Optical bonding is not new to me nor most steadicam operators. Its been used since, well since the Steadicam model 1. When it comes to dirt migrating to the front of the screen It will do that just because of the electrical field the LCD produces threw glass panel, or at least that is what I have seen. This may vary from operator to operator observations. As far as balance and weight placement Vs a green screen from any green screen CRT manufacturer. I again politely disagree with your assessment as a steadicam operator. But to me it doesn’t matter because they are two different technologies and ”it is what it is” so they say. Operators that use a LCD Vs. green screen will have to live with the difference of weight distribution no matter who makes the monitor or brackets. For those who have never used a CRT monitor, they wouldn’t know what the difference is anyway. If you would like to send me a monitor for testing I would be more than happy to repeat the test and post my results. I would be fair and impartial like I think I am, but I will also call it as I see it. Because that is who I am. Respectfully Greg Bubb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members chris bangma Posted July 3, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Having both the 1280x800 screen and the 1024x600 screen side by side with the same image, the color on the 1024x600 is much better. Both may claim the same color, but the 1024x600 is far more saturated, and more pleasing to the eye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Benjamin Treplin Posted July 3, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 I just posted a review here that also includes a heat test I did on Monday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Stefano Ben Posted July 3, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Hi All! Today most of us are chasing the HD Monitors without improve their job Yeah, ok, ok, I know! You can't see black things that should be out of your frame on a greenscreen monitor... Come on!!! Where are your eyes!?? 40 years of greenscreen monitors aaannd... I don't saw thousand errors on thousand films I saw) and... the major camera manufacturers chasing the K Definition... 2,3,4,5K etc. and the major production film companies, rent the best cameras without improve their stories. This wrong situation reminds me the opening shot of "Touch of Evil" There wasn't ways to do that... they didn't have technocranes, drones, steadicams.... but they did it! Anyway... I don't know personally Mr. Bubb but since he is a great professionist and a honest person, he gave me a great favour in past that he know I didn't forgot! So, now, I Just want to remember to All of Us that All frames we have composed in direct sunlight, were made possible thanks to Greg and his TB-6! Just this! Since I still operating with my TB-6 and sometimes with a 3A Sled with a 3" Green Screen Monitor without any problems... Personally, I will wait a few years before changing my beloved TB-6 and upgrade it. Even more so now that I know the Cinetronic must to have the same weight to be still balanced on my sled just like my TB-6. Just an opinion of a "poor/green screen lover/owner operator" Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Jens Piotrowski SOC Posted July 13, 2013 Premium Members Report Share Posted July 13, 2013 I just wanted to thank Chris and Mike for the fast response. My monitor was modified yesterday and that should fix the issue for good. Greg, thx for making us aware of the issue, and as always, your equipment is making my work better every day. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Jerry Hill Posted March 24, 2014 Premium Members Report Share Posted March 24, 2014 Definition of Ethics: Moral principles or practice. Mike Skipp and Chris Bangma is it your policy to knock-off everyone’s products? You guys have knocked-off Panavision, Libra Head, Omni Shot, Arriflex, Hill Products, Cinematic Precision and others, so many in fact that you are open to a class action lawsuit. Do you guys have any original thought at all? I cannot count the number of times I have been contacted to fix your product. Greg Bubb do not give them any information because they will steal it! I ask everyone to boycott purchasing from Film-Stuff and Cinewidgets. Please do not encourage the practice of knock-offs. They have no ethics! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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