Ruben Sluijter Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Whoa there, slow down...nobody's talking about burning books or anything that extreme. I can understand the fears people have when confronted with losing income and work but I don't see how stageing a protest will help anyone. If anything it might create even more bad blood between studios and crews. let's face it, this is a business and the final goal of the studios is to make the biggest possible profit. They've started figuring out that they can save money by going overseas which in turn means that they can add that to any profits made from the movie. This puts American crews in a weak position because you don't have much to bargain with (protesting certainly won't be enough) Don't make the mistake of underestimating the abilities of 'foreign' crews, there's some really good people out there so that's not much of a bargaining chip either. I really hope you can find some sort of solution but the fact remains that runaway productions are a reality now and it's not going to go away anytime soon. Get the word out, seek publicity and let people know about your problem but don't expect the studios to cave easily. Just my thoughts, don't get mad.... Peace, Ruben "Still running away..." Sluijter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Rhodes Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Hi, > Better not tell the French with their thriving film industry. Well that's exactly the point; French films sell in France simply because the locals like to watch local film. US film sells in the US for the same reason. For some reason, we don't care here. God knows why. Also, we don't share a language with the countries you mentioned; I wonder how much that has to do with it. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Alec Jarnagin SOC Posted February 9, 2004 Moderators Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 How about all of the laid off workers from those factories, and the secondary impact on the various businesses (restaurants, etc.) near those factories that have lost significant numbers of customers as a trickle down effect? Ahh, so that is how trickle down economics work! Silly me; I thought it had to do with money trickling down - guess I should have read the fine print before I declared it a stupid economic system. As for Flint Michigan, in "Downsize This" Michael Moore shows a picture of a downtown building from Flint in 1996 right below a picture of the bombed out Federal building in Oklahoma City. His caption reads, "What is Terrorism?" While his over the top antics have certainly made him unpopular in some circles, it sure as hell makes you stop and think. He goes on to criticize the "profit is supreme" argument by saying we have laws that outlaw crack, as it harms our population - even though there is tons of money in it. Therefore, we need to have laws forcing corporations to stay here, or at the very least pay restitution to the communities they leave in ruins causing its people to start smoking crack! As for burning books and last names? Come on. Would you buy a Steadicam arm from someone you didn't know their name? It was merely suggested that Brian include his name when he talks about a new product! Funny thing is, there are people here who remember a time when the entire Steadicam community could operate with first names alone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruben Sluijter Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Funny thing is, there are people here who remember a time when the entire Steadicam community could operate with first names alone! I remember someone's fist name! :D Peace, Ruben "First name basis with the world" Sluijter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Gross Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Hi, > Better not tell the French with their thriving film industry. Well that's exactly the point; French films sell in France simply because the locals like to watch local film. US film sells in the US for the same reason. For some reason, we don't care here. God knows why. Also, we don't share a language with the countries you mentioned; I wonder how much that has to do with it. Phil Well that might be your point but what does it have to do with the topic of runaway production? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Hardwick Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Alec, When you wrote, "Ahh, so that is how trickle down economics work!," I would just like to clarify that I was not actually referencing the economic theory or "system". If you read the post I made carefully, I wrote "a trickle down effect," not "the trickle down effect." You may not have meant that as a jab, but you know how posts are... it's difficult to discern the tone of the post sometimes. In any case, I'm no expert in economics, and as always, I am just voicing my own observations and opinions. Anthony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Rhodes Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Hi, >Well that might be your point but what does it have to do with the topic of runaway production? I don't think you have a problem because Americans will always watch American film and make a point of doing so, at least that's what I've seen. Now it's possible that a film like "Cold Mountain" is sufficiently American-looking to fool everyone. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Gross Posted February 9, 2004 Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Hi, >Well that might be your point but what does it have to do with the topic of runaway production? I don't think you have a problem because Americans will always watch American film and make a point of doing so, at least that's what I've seen. Now it's possible that a film like "Cold Mountain" is sufficiently American-looking to fool everyone. Phil Great, so I'll always have plenty of content to sit and watch at home as I twiddle my thumbs because these productions are happening in other countries and I'm unemployed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members jay kilroy Posted February 9, 2004 Premium Members Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 Thought you guys might find this interesting. Maybe your protests have already started??? By Stuart Kemp and Scott Roxborough Hollywood Reporter Updated: 10:45 p.m. ET Feb. 05, 2004 Miramax Films co-chairman Harvey Weinstein said Thursday he believes the low Oscar-nomination count for ?Cold Mountain? was due in part to stories in the U.S. press attacking the moviemakers? decision to shoot the U.S. Civil War drama in Europe and not America. Weinstein, who jetted in to support the Anthony Minghella-directed story, which opened the Berlin International Film Festival, hinted that there had been a whispering campaign against the production because the filmmakers chose to shoot largely in lower-cost Romania. Said Weinstein: ?I?m proud of ?Cold Mountain? being a European film. The movie has done $80 million at the U.S. box office so far and is on its way to $100 million. But I think it (being shot in Romania) did hurt us with the Academy (voters).? Weinstein stopped short of calling it a boycott by voters but said negative press may have resulted in ?a move to deny the movie awards.? The film received seven Oscar nominations, but not in the key best picture and director categories. Said Minghella: ?There has been a reaction in America and a real campaign to stop movies leaving America to shoot.? While Minghella said he understood the criticism, he defended his decision to shoot in Romania on economic terms. ?It was a choice between making the movie (outside America) or not,? he said. ?We still spent nearly $20 million in the U.S.? Weinstein also attacked what he called American ?discrimination? against European films and cited an example of how few are seen in the United States. ?We believe in European quotas because European movies are discriminated against in America,? Weinstein said. ?The major networks in America have not shown one single European movie in 25 years.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Charles Papert Posted February 9, 2004 Premium Members Report Share Posted February 9, 2004 This is clearly an issue that we are not all going to agree on. Those who are affected by it, i.e. have lost work as a result of it, are going to be more inclined to want to act on it than those who are not affected because they never had that work in the first place, or are even benefitting from runaway production since they live or work in Canada or Romania, for instance. Obviously everyone is free to post whatever they want. But bearing in mind the circumstances above, would it be too much to suggest that if one is an operator that is not affected by the issue, don't denigrate the concerns of those who are? No-one I know blames the crew that is getting the work elsewhere for runaway production. So why should we be resented for raising concerns that affect us directly, whether or not there is anything we as individuals can do about it? And it appears that this very point is up for debate, which is an age-old issue; why bother protesting about anything, ever, when the problem is "out of your hands". Historically I think its safe to say that there has been evidence of grass-roots protest campaigns having significant impact on the policies of big business and/or government, and other instances where they haven't. Apparently the FTAC campaign against "Cold Mountain" has succeeded in bringing the issue to the forefront. Mirimax will likely be thinking twice about taking certain future shows out of the country, not because its the right or wrong thing to do, but because from a business standpoint they might jeopardize that picture's Academy Award potential due to the sentiments of the Academy Award voters. Axium has been exposed as promoting runaway production and has publicly back-pedaled. These are significant achievements for the cause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members jay kilroy Posted February 10, 2004 Premium Members Report Share Posted February 10, 2004 Charles... I certainly didn't mean any disrespect with my post. I am an operator and I feel I am being affected by this situation. It may not be to the level as you and some others here are but I am affected none the less. I have read some interesting posts on this topic and thought some of the others may take an interest in the article I posted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Charles Papert Posted February 10, 2004 Premium Members Report Share Posted February 10, 2004 None taken, I actually was writing my post before yours came up. My thoughts were not in response to any single previous post, rather several of them that are reflecting attitudes that have been presented in the past as well as in this thread. In fact, I think that article actually reflects and supports my comments. I have modified my original post to replace "you" with "one" so that this is more clear. Thanks for the heads-up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Alec Jarnagin SOC Posted February 10, 2004 Moderators Report Share Posted February 10, 2004 Anthony, No, I was not jabbing you - just playing with words so I could poke fun of the economic system with a similar name. We get $600 back to "stimulate the economy" while we watch corporations get huge tax breaks to deport our jobs, leaving us to spend fortunes on health insurance, schools, etc. I assure you, I meant no offense Anthony. Best Regards, Alec Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Hardwick Posted February 10, 2004 Report Share Posted February 10, 2004 Alec, I didn't think it was meant as a jab, and I wasn't offended. Hope You're keeping warm this Winter and staying busy. Please say hello to Jamie for me when you see him. Maybe I'll catch up with you guys over a couple of pints this Spring sometime. Take care, Anthony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Brad Grimmett Posted February 10, 2004 Premium Members Report Share Posted February 10, 2004 labense el orto con labandina y una esponja patito manga de putosmr grimmet thinks tha my english sucks it is true....so get your self a translator thanks alot Don't need one thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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