BRIANBUSBY Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 I'm assuming you are a machinist for MK-V. no you assume wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Alec Jarnagin SOC Posted March 16, 2007 Moderators Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 Brian, A little cryptic on those replies, no? I for one am always concerned with the consistency of manufacturing and adhering to tolerances. Variations in tolerances is way too common among machine shops (funny because they have better tools than ever). No one is out to bust the worker bees' chops, but these variations can be a real thorn in our side. Ultimately, it is up to the manufacturer to find machinists that get it done right. I once had a machinist tell me the price goes up exponentially as the decimal points of tolerance increase (just look at the different levels of gimbals out there). How often have we seen a part that would otherwise seem to fit, but the anodization is too thick? While our equipment may not require aerospace tolerances, they do require very high standards. I've seen more than one equipment manufacturer change machinists because of quality control problems. These issues when released into market can cause unforeseen problems. Ask Jim Bartell about the ever so slight increase in the size of the focus knobs on his hand units after the first run. Doesn't seem like a big deal until you try and make hard plastic strips that slip onto the focus knobs. One size does not fit all. As a result, they had to do a lot of head scratching and make these strips with two different slots to affix them to the hand unit. Jim didn't freak out on the worker bees (I think he considers himself one), but he did spend a lot of time and energy fixing the problem because this is what a good manufacturer does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRIANBUSBY Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 alec im not beaing cyrptic just truthfull. the comment you made about tolerances is correct the tighter the limit the more it costs. why do you think f1 ( nascar ) cars cost so much to make brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Charles Papert Posted March 16, 2007 Premium Members Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 this is an insult to the machinists who strided very hard to make what was designed i'm sorry to have to post this but as one of these people i feel insulted beyond belief Brian, it's perfectly logical to assume from what you wrote that you are one of the machinists to whom you refer, i.e. those who built the AR. Since you have subsequently told us that you aren't, then perhaps you would be so kind as to explain what your relationship is to all of this--everyone else here has (presumably you are a Steadicam operator if you are in this forum?) It makes it so much easier when we all know who we are speaking to, that's why we use real names here on the, uh, "muppet forum". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRIANBUSBY Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 ok here goes i own one of the companies that manufacture for howard i have done work for the film industry for over 30 years. so i do have some idea what is wanted. i'm sorry if i took your comments out of the ment context. i do agree on some levels the person who makes a component of any kind would be accountable for what is made but making things light / strong and movable and then anodised can be a hard concept to try for. i have known howard for many years and have been through many ups and downs with him and when i saw the engineering being critised i saw red. as i cant be accountable for how a unit is used out in the field i cant answer your question does every body tighten locking screws with the same preasure , i get many units sent to me of various manufacture for repair it never ceases to amaze me how some people can damage equipment and it never seems the same faults so a lot of human error can come into the equation. problems are addresed when faults appear but on any new product how can you predict what will happen out in the field. brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members WillArnot Posted March 16, 2007 Premium Members Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 Point taken Brian, thanks for the clarification on your position. I will discuss further details privately. The relative point that needs to be made here is that Howard fails to listen to the results of how things perform in the field. Instead of discussion and involvement with people such as yourself so we can get 3 brains going on a problem that needs rectifying - Howard chooses to deny and point the finger. Either at you or me. Totally unproductive. And when we are talking about operator error when it comes to a tie down screw, it gets pretty absurd to be told that there isn't a problem or it's our fault when the camera is simply unstable on it's baseplate. We can continue the design discussion privately. If two screws are a problem for people, then maybe there should be just one. W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJ Williams Posted March 18, 2007 Report Share Posted March 18, 2007 As outsiders to all this we cannot know who is right. Perhaps no one reads this anyway? because there are 25 approx. systems out there and we do not have posts from those owners telling us what they think about problems with the MkVAR. Lynn has not posted here yet he is the one who has appearantly according to Will etc. lost the most. My son and I attended the nab last year and tried out the AR, which seemed to work well, in try on demos, except for the straight down problem. Admittedly this was with small video cameras and wide lenses. We both felt that one would need two sleds, and production would have to spring for a second body to keep from holding things up. I'm not offended by critical comments about Steadi. related products. I wish I'd heard the same about Pro-gear before I tried to buy from them... critical comments about a product can both help the vender fix problems and warn potential customers. It is important however that there are a number of users who are critical to make their comments persuasive. It's hard for me to understand in this relatively limited business how the AR owners don't find each other? Instead of lamenting the friendliness of this thread I would encourage both parties to get others who agree with them to post here telling their own stories so the community can better judge the truth. I'm especially interested to know about operational and technological problems with any piece of gear... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members benedictspence Posted March 18, 2007 Premium Members Report Share Posted March 18, 2007 Hello All! What a big mess this thread is.... have been reading it the past couple of weeks and man what a shit slinging match it has become! It feels like I'm watching some kind of soap here. Or maybe a car crash. RE the AR. I want to say that here and now I truly don't know which side to believe; and this isn't an invitation for more accusations and name calling (so please don't guys). I'm saying that when two sides both disagree this strongly with each other I would assume that the full truth is somewhere in between. To be honest i'm getting to the point where I actually couldn't care less and I reckon most other ops will feel the same way. It serves no purpose what-so-ever having everyone shouting "THIS is the REAL truth" then kicking off at each other. Eric and Will; your resume's are outstanding and full respect to both of you. Howard, even when not including the AR, you've created a fantastic product and built a worldwide business around it. As for slagging off each others operating etc. I've been on jobs where I've been the grumpiest, shitest operator in the world, but I've also been on jobs where I've been the mac-daddy of the camera world and some kind of comic genius at the same time. We all have good days and bad days but just because you hate each others guts (be honest!) it doesn't mean that you shouldn't show the proper respect to each other. Especially in a public forum like this... Would you have this kind of fight if you met on set? Everyone who has read this board has heard what you have to say. Some people on this board know you all personally or by proxy but there are many more who don't and I don't think they are going to be forming very good opinions of you. It may feel like you are standing up for yourselves but I think you are doing your reputations more harm than good among those who read these boards; even if you are correct, yelling and name calling in public makes you look like a nutter! Well that's my opinion on this squabble. And more importantly, as requested, as an MK-V Nexus owner... I've had my sled for just over a year. I was totally torn between the Nexus and Pro; both were fantastic but neither were perfect; a very hard decision to make. I've taken my Nexus round the world on loads of different jobs from DV to film and it has performed brilliantly. Faults? None; just differences. Um... the sled can feel a bit long, even in it's shortest position but that's a 4 stage post for you (bloody useful it has been too!). If it had really bothered me I would have gotten a pro. I love the XCS ergo handle which can be used on the pro but not the Nexus. However that 2" post/gimbal is awsome and again I chose the Nexus over the pro. I prefered the battery adjustment on the bottom of the pro but got the tilting top-stage for the Nexus instead! The rubber buttons on the monitor like to get ripped off but that's my own clumsy fault and MK-V have sent me loads of replacements. The monitor cable is a little long but I could just get a shorter one or a curley one. I'm really trying to scrape some criticism on the rig together here! No bullshit; Howard is a pretty terse guy but I chose MK-V for the kit not because of Howard's personality. To be honest I'd rather he was to-the-point; this is business after all and I want a Steadicam kit not a new best friend! Service wise... the kit was delievered on time, a couple of batteries were a week late but totally understandable. Whenever I've needed a spare screw or button I've received it within a couple of days and at no charge. I wasn't swamped with free t-shirts and MK-V sandbags when I bought my Nexus, but they've been there when I've needed them and I trust if there was ever a true emergency they would be able to sort it out quickly. Scandal free as far as my experience goes! Let's just get back to giggling over 'Don-Juan' vs 'Missionary', please! Ben Spence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members Jerry Holway Posted March 19, 2007 Premium Members Report Share Posted March 19, 2007 Hello All! I prefered the battery adjustment on the bottom of the pro but got the tilting top-stage for the Nexus instead! Ben Spence Ben- Glad you like the tilting stage. It's a wonderful idea, and that's why Garrett and I patented it. It took a lot of effort and inspiration to get it right. Howard promised Garrett in person that he would not "rip us off" and sell an integral tilt head... oh well. Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members benedictspence Posted March 19, 2007 Premium Members Report Share Posted March 19, 2007 In that case... thank you Jerry! :) And for your DB primer; I had that sat next to my toilet for 6 months... Truly it made me understand Steadicam rather than just feeling my way through it! I understand your feelings and I know perhaps it is just semantics, but I would like to correct you; the tilting top stage I have with my Nexus is made by Chrosziel and not in fact MK-V, although MK-V did sell it to me. The rest I can't and wouldn't want to comment on, mate. I didn't post on this thread to get drawn into the debate so I'm not going to anymore! Ben Spence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean-Nicolas Dorion Posted March 19, 2007 Report Share Posted March 19, 2007 Hello guys, As an outsider in all of this, I was happy to finally see a satisfied MK-V customer... But here we go again... Howard just doesn't seem to know what's a patent for. He should'nt try to take credit or profits from someone else's ideas. Even though he looks like a good fellow and is really inspired in all he does, he needs to calm down and settle things out. I would have difficulty to trust MK-V and prefer to give my money and confidence in Garrett and Jerry which I respect over all... That's my opinion. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members JobScholtze Posted March 19, 2007 Premium Members Report Share Posted March 19, 2007 but I would like to correct you; the tilting top stage I have with my Nexus is made by Chrosziel and not in fact MK-V, Jean, Lets keep this topic strait with facts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Faye Posted March 19, 2007 Report Share Posted March 19, 2007 Fact: The tilting stage patent belongs to Jerry and Garrett. Fact: Chrosziel makes and sells a rip-off tilting stage, breaking the law. They know it very well and they don?t care. Fact: Howard at MK-V, knowing all of the above, is re-selling Chrosziel tilt stages and getting a small commission every time. Personal opinion: The fact that Howard is re-selling a patent-violating product is equally unethical and preposterous, no different than as if he was manufacturing it himself. Also: Howard is re-selling Chrosziel non-tilting top stages. Nothing wrong with that. Only GPI wouldn?t give him a commission deal, and that is why he doesn?t ?recommend? the Donkey Box 3 to his clients for sometime now. Of course he will deny it and say that the Chrosziel stage is simply better. Dear Job: Please wait till you spend £32.000 on an AR, only to find that it works occasionally (at best), and discover like many others that Howard?s support and service evaporate when he has nothing more to sell you. Dear Ben: You are too young to address Jerry as ?mate? and too green to attempt to ?correct? him in any steadicam-related issue. You are of course free to feel otherwise and contemplate your own thoughts while sitting on that toilet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Premium Members benedictspence Posted March 19, 2007 Premium Members Report Share Posted March 19, 2007 Woah there Mark! Sorry, just trying to be friendly, bro. Wasn't trying to be disrespectful, nor smart-arsed, only to clarify. I hope Jerry understands this. I could easily snap back a nasty comment to you too, but I'm not going to because I don't know you and wouldn't want to make any assumptions about you. I'm old enough to understand basic manners, at least. Ben :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Burton Posted March 19, 2007 Report Share Posted March 19, 2007 Yeah Ben your just too green to have an opinion mate you better just keep quite ! OMFG PS loved your work on the gumball mate, Gez kept txting me when it was on. Herd so many stories from that trip when in Berlin on the XBOX job :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.