What would your perfect LCD monitor include?

[JobScholtze]

Duh, didnt see that.

I would love to see this monitor. And to test it

[Luis Sinibaldi]

JobScholtze,

 

No problem, I think maybe I need to make it more clear that those words are links.

 

I would love to show it to you, but unfortunately it looks like you are in the Neatherlands. :(

 

I'm actually just releasing the first units now. This Wednesday 12/5 my monitor will be at the Redrock Micro booth at DV Expo in Burbank California. Brian V. from RR was kind enough to purchase one, and will be showing it at his booth along 2 other competing products. (he is not selling it, nor representing me) He is showing off Redrock Products like the M2 35mm adapter, and he is using my monitor to show the image coming out of the camera. So for those interested, you can go see the resolution, color rendition, brightness (pre Steady High-Brite Version) and Angle of View (which is amazing)

 

It would probably be around 2 months before I come up with the Steady version of it.

[Martin Stacey]

Hi,

 

The specs state that the power input is 12V. Does this require a regulated power supply or are you able to build it to be capable of handling 11-30V as we often operate anywhere within that power range depending on the freshness of our batteries and the type of camera we are using.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[Jess Haas SOC]

As for weight, right now it is 3.1lb or so. but I would make the case even tougher for you guys, so who knows. But if I understand it correctly, you actually need it to have some weight to it to counter balance the camera? What would be ideal weight for this monitor?

Most people want a little weight because they are used to the weight of their old CRT monitors. I am actually growing to like a lite monitor because it allows me to add a battery for weight when I want it, or keep the rig as light as possible when I don't. I personally don't mind any weight that you add in order to make it more durable, but wouldn't want you adding weight over what it is now simply for the sake of adding weight.

 

 

I did post that I would have the two standard connectors for power (limo and hirose) I know that the current connector would be no good for the steadycam world.

The lemo or hirose should allow for the input of composite video as well as power. A tally light would be another useful future for this monitor which would be very simple and cheap to add. Tiffen uses an 8-pin lemo on the Ultra2 that connects composite video, power and tally. If you want a reference for what connectors and pin configuration they are using check out: http://www.steadicam.com/images/content/U2...uts_Jumpers.pdf

 

Different sleds will have different connections but you don't need to provide all of them on the Monitor because people can always use a cable with a different connector on each side.

 

In addition to the Lemo and/or Hirose you should provide a 4-pin XLR connector for power. This is a very standard connector and will allow people to also use the monitor off the sled or come up with a power solution in case of cable or connector problems.

 

The voltage regulator in the monitor needs to atleast be able to handle voltages as high as 17volts, 34 volts would be even better. Most people use 14.4volt batteries that I have seen get as high as 17volts when hot off the charger. They use two of them for "24volt" power.

 

Would it be possible to also provide a lower cost non ultrabright version of the steadicam monitor? I think there might be a market there for lower end steadicam users who would want something more in line with the price you are offering your current monitor for but would want the other steadicam specific features.

 

~Jess

[Charles Papert]

Which sled has the potential of running 34 volts through the monitor output??!

[Luis Sinibaldi]

Martin,

 

Regulated power would be better, but I've tested it with both IDX Endura7 batteries, and Anton Bauer Hytron Batteries. Both Put out about 16.5v when fully charged. The monitor does well with both. As far as going above 18v, it might be an issue. Again, I'm trying to adapt to the Steadicam World Needs. So if you were to tell me that 50% of Steadicam Ops have 17v and above, then I would have to have some sort of regulator to bring down power.

 

All these options would probably add to the cost of the unit, but being that I would be the new kid on the block, you can rest assure that I would either come at a lower price than competitors, or not continue with the project.

 

Jess,

Just saw your post about the battery power. Like I said, its been able to handle the newer technology batteries from both Anton Bauer & IDX. So that is good. As far as 24v I'll have to inquire about it.

 

The Hirose or Lemo carry power and composite video, I was aware of that and I already had that in mind. a tally led, would be no problem. The 4 pin XLR is also not a problem, (could you get me a spec on that?)

 

As far as the lower end-one, I'm one step ahead of you. I'm considering it already. I think I have an idea that will make many people happy. I will of course introduce the Higher end products first and then work on providing the lower end ones.

 

edit: Also Jess, I'm not thinking of adding weight for weight's sake, but I am thinking of making the case stronger than the current design. (currently its 1/16" aluminum, with welded edges, etc.. its pretty sturdy if you ask me, but you guys like to bump things around, climb steps, rough terrain etc.... hahaha) I might dub it the Carrion Evil (in memory of one of the Great American Hero "Evil Knievel" R.I.P.) I usually don't care to be P.C., but in this case I'll make an exception. If anyone thinks this name is inappropriate, I apologize and I will remove this comment.

 

Please everyone chip in. the more input at this stage, the more it will end up meeting your needs. (now I'm no genie, but I'll do my best :) )

Edited December 4, 2007 by siniarch

[Rob Vuona SOC]

Hey Luis,

As you can see the perfect steadicam monitor is widely discussed on this forum and God knows we are all very willing to test, comment and buy "The One" !

 

In my opinion . . . .8.4" is too big, at least it is for my applications, Boland has the 8.4" already and has proved it's a usable size and weight, but that being said Please keep working on it we need the perfect monitor.

 

Being that you are the monitor guru is there a huge difference to make a 8.4 into a 7" or is the supply and demand for that size LCD not enough to justify the cost. That is what Boland told me at NAB this year so, Is it that we are all having to use the 8.4" instead.

 

The perfect Monitor in my world at least would be:

7"

NTSC

HD/SDI

1000nits

Fmameline gen.

Electronic Level

 

I don't care about whatever power you have I'll make a cable, But Hirosi would work in my world

 

Thanks for keeping us posted

 

Rob "Sick of lugging 3 monitors around" Vuona

[Luis Sinibaldi]

Hi Rob,

Thank you so much for you input. (as for Guru, I'm not sure I qualify, but thanks)

 

As why Boland stated that there is no good demand for 7" monitors, I'm not sure. They are a bigger company and must have done some market research.

 

For me the decision came because I wanted more than 800x480 pixels. I have an HVX and bought a 35mm adapter (Redrock M2 to be specific) and pulling focus is a nightmare with the on board LCD. So I looked at the Marshall and wasn't happy with viewing angle nor with brightness and resolution.

 

As far as I know, there is only ONE LCD screen that has 1024x768 and is under 10" and that is the one I decided to go with. (this was at least at the time of my R&D.) My guess is that unless Panasonic is making their own LCD screen (which they might or be buying from the same supplier as my mnf.) the $4890 Panasonic monitor probably is the same LCD screen as mine. Panasonic BT-LH900A

 

So my decision is purely based on resolution. if there was a 7" LCD screen with that resolution and viewing angle I probably would have gone that route. (since I will be using it for shoulder mount operations and weight is an issue)

 

What I'm working on which is the difficult part for me is, Frame-generator and Electronic level. (the electronic level I might have to leave out. But I'll look into it also)

[Charles Papert]

I'm not aware of any existing Steadicam monitors that incorporate a level, so I wouldn't worry about that Luis. Most rigs have the sensors built-in or added on and simply insert the level into the video feed, so for SD it would automatically appear. At some point we'll need a level that the HD-SDI signal can loop through also, but I think that's someone else's headache.

[Alec Jarnagin SOC]

Louis,

 

Welcome to the forum. Please change your display name to your real name (first & last). That is one of our rules for the community. I know you mean no offense, but please remove the banner from your signature. Feel free to list your company name, web site & contact info in your signature, but the banner constitutes an Ad and as you can see, others are paying for that privilege. Tim Tyler, the man responsible for this forum, pays for it out of pocket so it is only fair that Ads do bring in a little money for him to off-set his costs.

 

As for your monitor, it sounds great. I wouldn't worry about the lever either. It is best to have the level sensor in a fixed position by the center post (even the PRO monitor, which has the level built in, has a separate sensor pack by the center post). Doing this provides a more accurate response.

 

Thanks.

[Luis Sinibaldi]

Alec,

Thanks for the info. I've updated my signature and display name. :) (sorry about that)

 

And thanks for you input.

 

Luis

[Jess Haas SOC]

Which sled has the potential of running 34 volts through the monitor output??!

No clue, and I personally don't need it, but I have heard people say they want it to handle 24volt power, and if you are running 14.4 volt batteries it can get that hot. My Trimpacks hot off the charger are 17.2volts. Multimeters can vary a bit but I am measuring with a high quality fluke meter that I trust.

 

I personally don't really see a need for running off of 24 volt power. It simply needs to be able to handle a 14.4v battery hot off the charger which it sounds like it already does. I would assume that it atleast has some sort of linear regulator for the electronics already built in. I have modified a number of LCDs for my own purposes and when I have taken them apart they have all had a regulator that could handle my batteries no problem. If it is a linear regulator it might not be able to handle that high of voltage for too long due to extra heat output, but luckily that voltage quickly drops to a more reasonable one.

 

One concern I have is whether the higher voltages are overdriving the backlight and whether this is decreasing its life?

 

The XLR power connector should be a male 4 pin XLR. A good sturdy panel mount connector will take a whole lot more abuse than the connector you are currently using.

Standard 4pin "XLR"

Pin 1 = GND

Pin 4 = +12 volts

 

Is there any way to overlay a composite signal onto an HD one? If so that could be a solution for using the analogue digital levels that are out there. The easier way to implement a digital level might be through LEDs on the case instead of overlaying it on the screen. I don't know if this would be a suitable option as I have never used one.

 

Another feature that would be really nice but I have never actually seen in a monitor is a built in downconverter. This would deal with the fact that no one has an HD video transmitter and set your monitor apart from everything else on the market. This is a wishlist of course, although if you can find the right components this is one thing that might not be as difficult as it sounds.

 

~Jess

[Jess Haas SOC]

Weatherproofing the monitor as you mentioned before would be a really nice feature. Of course it would require closing up the vent holes so you need to make sure that overheating does not become a problem even in 100degree weather. You already have a metal case so if it can act as enough of a heatsink that could solve that problem.

 

If you did this you would probably need to move the connectors to the bottom of the monitor. You should have the steadicam connectors there anyway. If the monitor has a flip function(which it should), and threaded holes on the top and bottom I don't see any reason why it couldn't operate in either orientation anyway. Lemo actually makes waterproof connectors, I don't know if they are compatible with their other connectors or not though.

 

I just want something that can survive in the rain without a rain cover. If this ups the price much it probably isn't worh it. If you can make it able to survive a quick dunk in a pool that would be useful for me as I also do underwater work and that would make it a good top side monitor for that.

 

Another thing that I have never scene a monitor have but would be useful for on camera work is a mounting hole on the side. This can make mounting easier in some situations without needing as crazy of an arm setup.

 

Be careful about making everyone happy though. If you do figure out how to make the perfect monitor that does everything we want it may end up costing too much for any of us to afford! :-)

 

~Jess

[Luis Sinibaldi]

Jess,

Yes, the monitor should be able to handle the 14.4 batteries hot of the charger. :)

 

As for the power, for the Steadicam Version, I will change the connector to a 4 pin XLR.

 

As for over driving the back light; my current models have a backlight control, and the inverter that drives the back light on my monitor is actually more powerful than the specs for the LCD. (so if left to max all the time, it would shorten the life of the LCD.) But then that is why I left the control. People should use the LCD at a lower setting at most times, and when needed (outside work under the sun) you would turn up the backlight. I would try to keep in the same lines here, though I'm guessing I will probably need a different inverter to power up the lights above 1000nits.

 

There is a way to get composite signal over the HD signal by way of PIP. unfortunately, I can't have that PIP be transparent. :(

 

The only Downconverters I know of are super expensive, about $800 and up. So I could include it, but like you said, it would probably drive the cost much higher.

 

As for weatherproofing, I think I got something up my sleve. I'll get you guys info on this once I have it all figured out.

 

When you say take a dunk what does that mean. Underwater work? a good Top side Monitor for that? (you mean completely submerged?) or do you mean you would have your rig in the water witht he camera in a waterproof case, and the monitor on top outsideof the water. (I just can't picture this. sorry)

[Jess Haas SOC]

There is a way to get composite signal over the HD signal by way of PIP. unfortunately, I can't have that PIP be transparent. :(

Any way to only overlay a portion of the incoming composite signal? If you could somehow just overlay the electronic level image it wouldn't necessarily need to be transparent. I know its a long shot, just trying to help! :-)

 

The only Downconverters I know of are super expensive, about $800 and up. So I could include it, but like you said, it would probably drive the cost much higher.

I know that there are very inexpensive devices available that can do vga->composite. Any way to tap out of the signal going to the LCD at some point and send it to something like that? I don't know if any of them would support the correct resolutions though....

 

When you say take a dunk what does that mean. Underwater work? a good Top side Monitor for that? (you mean completely submerged?) or do you mean you would have your rig in the water witht he camera in a waterproof case, and the monitor on top outsideof the water. (I just can't picture this. sorry)

What I meant was making it to where it could survive if it was accidentally put completely underwater for a brief moment. What I had in mind was for use when the camera is underwater or at the surface in an underwater case with a video cable coming out, having a monitor that was suitable for someone to stand in the water with it in their hands above the water. Basically something that doesn't mind getting splashed and that could survive an accidental drop. This is totally non steadicam related and probably asking far too much :-)

 

Now if you could make a version that was completely submersible with waterproof connectors I have a completely different market to talk to you about :-) An underwater housing for the monitor would probably be a much more realistic option.

 

~Jess