NBC/Uni up to their old ways

[Stephen Vanderspek]

Hi all

 

The following opinion may not be popular but here goes.... :huh:

 

I work in a small regional market here in Australia where Steadicam gigs are few and far between but I accept that insurance is part of the cost of doing business, anyway it's a write off. My big gig for the year was the Beijing Olympics where they specifically stated they aren't responsible for my gear in any way, shape or form.

 

I have about $100K of production gear and only insure the hi ticket items that leave the premises. My insurance bill is just over $3000 for $65k of world wide cover. When charging $1000-1500 as a day player, that's probably not even 3 days work for a lot of ops in major markets. I'm not sure why you guys are whinging?

 

Why not save your selves the agro and get insurance, raise your rates slightly to cover and then you don't get production's knickers in a twist about the whole issue. You may even end up on their preferred list because you're user friendly and get more work.

 

Off the top of my head I can't think of too many businesses where the client pays an extra charge to look after your business capital investment. If I were a auto mechanic I wouldn't give a bill that itemized my service plus the insurance on my socket set, wrenches, etc.

 

Maybe I don't have a complete grasp of all aspects of this issue but it seems some ops on occasion slip into become elitist and a lttle precious about who they are and what they do.

 

Please correct me if my view is misinformed or just plain stupid. :unsure:

 

Cheers

Norbert

 

The idea is that Steadicam is basically just another piece of equipment should be insured by the production, just like any other piece of production equipment. As to the added charge on their insurance, 100-200k is a pittance of their overall insurance.

[Norbert von der Heidt]

Hi Stephen

 

I guess that's the real question then isn't it? Are they hiring you for the skills and creativity you can contribute to the production and that as an bonus, you'll be supplying your own "tools of the trade", or are you just the default human operator attached to the right priced hardware package???

 

We all have a facination for the hardware and toys of the biz and we enjoy buying it, modifying it, trading it, etc. Never forget though, without you, it's just a pile of nuts and bolts waiting to be animated.

 

This is where I see a lot of the present day problems with producers not respecting what we do anymore and getting cheap, because we force them to think of Steadicam as a hardware thing that has to be insured, etc. Who can blame producers when, as far as they're concerned, we just become the warm body attached to the hardware they've negotiated hard for.

 

Stop dealing with them about the nuts and bolts or the insurance! Sell yourself instead, make the deal about you!

 

There, I've said my piece. Hope it made some sort of sense.

 

Cheers

Norbert :)

[RobVanGelder]

I'm with you on this one, Norbert.

When I left the Netherlands, I insured my equipment too, based on a Dutch insurance policy.

That saved me when I got a crash with my system here in Thailand.

 

Nowadays, I cannot afford an insurance anymore, but i am also not able to get one. Being an "alien" in Thailand means that I cannot get these services. Luckily i have teamed up with a rental company that covers me.

 

But renting from an European company will always involve a certain percentage of the rental price for obligatory insurance.

I just have received a quotation for a Photosonics Highspeed camera from Germany, they add 100 Euro per day on the bill for that for worldwide coverage and the production company is happy to pay that. (7 days- $700 )

This is in contrast to the insurance demands from the similar company in Los Angeles, which will cost us about 80.000 baht, that is $ 2.313 !!! and this is an insurance from a Thai company, special discounted rate and we (our company) has to arrange it.

 

That is just no comparison!

 

Not to mention the endless paperwork, faxes, approvals, etc....

Sure, there is always a deductible, but that can easily be covered in a contract or deal memo, and producers probably accept that better than the full responsibility.

[Eric Fletcher S.O.C.]

I told them it was a deal breaker, They are getting back to me ASAP...

 

Well they got back to me on friday. NBC Legal faxed us (Myself and my Agent) a letter stating that my gear IS insured and that I exempt from having to sign the box rental form as they understand that a steadicam kit is NOT a box rental, rather equipment rental.

 

In my case they are viewing me as a rental house, as it should be.

 

I will have a copy of the letter posted in a while.

 

One interesting aside. Showtime also did not want to provide an insurance cert last year when I started season two of "Dexter" their reasoning being that they will only cover a department heads gear. We got around that issue by simply pointing out that I was in fact a department head, the Head of the Steadicam Department. I had the cert in my hand in less than a hour.

 

Guys we have to fight for this and have the conviction to walk away from a job that tries this. Thanks for the interest and support.

[Alec Jarnagin SOC]

Good for you Eric. I'm glad that it was worked out.

 

Norbert & Rob, I understand what you guys are saying and I will not speak for you or your markets, but a counterpoint if I may. We are talking about insurance that is already in place - that all the other equipment vendors have. If you have an incident that requires you to collect on YOUR policy, your policy may not be renewed then you are left looking around for new insurance and paying more. Imagine you are in a car accident that is the other driver's fault. While you might have collision insurance that covers you in case the other person's insurance is no good, would you volunteer your own coverage simply to "be nice"?

[Jess Haas SOC]

One thing to keep in mind when it comes to who provides the insurance is that on most productions in the US you are working as an employee not an independent contractor. As an employee the production is responsible for your actions, as an independent contractor less so. So if you are an employee and something you do destroys the rig that they rented even if it was from you then they are responsible and that is the way it should be. I am not talking about purposeful destruction, but accidents do happen. Say the DP accidentally drops the camera, do they say the DP should have to pay for it or should have had his own insurance on it to cover the damage?

 

If production wants to pay for every item in my kit individually from a rental house they are welcome to do so. That is if they could find it. We are doing them a service by offering the equipment for rent, at a package price that is honestly a great deal for all that they are getting.

 

Also if you damage property as an employee they are liable for it. As an independent contractor you are expected to have your own liability insurance and what not.

 

This is one reason not to work in features where they want to hire people as independent contracts instead of employees. That is always a bad sign.

 

~Jess

[Sven Joukes]

steadicam kit is NOT a box rental, rather equipment rental.

 

Eric,

 

I'm not clear on the semantics here, could you please explain the difference?

 

Thanks!

 

Sven

[Eric Fletcher S.O.C.]

steadicam kit is NOT a box rental, rather equipment rental.

 

Eric,

 

I'm not clear on the semantics here, could you please explain the difference?

 

Thanks!

 

Sven

 

The difference is kit or box rental is personal gear used by you and only you required by your job and paid a rental on by production.

 

Equipment rental is the same as a camera rental. Gear used by many in order todo the job.

[Stephen Vanderspek]

Hi Stephen

 

I guess that's the real question then isn't it? Are they hiring you for the skills and creativity you can contribute to the production and that as an bonus, you'll be supplying your own "tools of the trade", or are you just the default human operator attached to the right priced hardware package???

 

We all have a facination for the hardware and toys of the biz and we enjoy buying it, modifying it, trading it, etc. Never forget though, without you, it's just a pile of nuts and bolts waiting to be animated.

 

This is where I see a lot of the present day problems with producers not respecting what we do anymore and getting cheap, because we force them to think of Steadicam as a hardware thing that has to be insured, etc. Who can blame producers when, as far as they're concerned, we just become the warm body attached to the hardware they've negotiated hard for.

 

Stop dealing with them about the nuts and bolts or the insurance! Sell yourself instead, make the deal about you!

 

There, I've said my piece. Hope it made some sort of sense.

 

Cheers

Norbert :)

 

I believe my working of my last post is what created a bit of confusion between you and me, what I meant was. When you are paid you are really paid for two things, what you spoke to about being a creative individual that is part of the team but they are also renting the equipment from you and just like renting cameras, from as used in a previous example, Panavision, it should be insured by the production.

 

But in the same breath I do understand your position and frankly I'd likely end up taking it particularly once I do start working, although as Mike said, it would depend who you are dealing with, big corporations like NBCU or CBS etc have HUGE legal teams that aren't afraid to sue anyone.